KeepItPrinting.com

[Augiedoggy]

Well my machine today just had a mid transport sensor failure... this machine is 6 months old. I ended up not having time to check for voltages but earlier in the day I had a call on a fuji machine and was able to check the sensor operation there I found those use 5v and actually change states down to 1.5 voltage when blocked... they are different (omron) sensors but look very similar to the "Sharp" brand sensors in the kip... same plugs and mounting brackets but they don't appear to be interchangeable and I don't plan to try.
I have never had one of those fail that I can remember.

[Augiedoggy]

Well Tuesday I had yet another sensor failure in the 7170 machine that had the cpld config error... This time a sensor at the fuser exit area failed. I was out of the country in training so another technician diagnosed and repaired the machine.
Today I received yet another call on another 7170 (about 5 months old) which had already had two sensors replaced a month after installation.I am going there monday but they are complaining of the same false jam errors with no obstructions in the media path. (This machine is on a power filter) .

So every single 7170 and 7100 but the first one that I installed in the field has now had a sensor (or multiple sensors) fail... I dont know why my area seems to be having the issue more frequently.

[Bubbleguts]

im getting the same issue only im getting a j-0106 code stops right after it cuts, tech support says hvs corona wire or separation sensor

[tech2tech]

Good news for the sensor issue. kip has bulletin k134-014 out with a fix. They now have a new style sensor out and you can get 8 of them for free for each machine within a specific serial number range. Every tech that is servicing the 7170 needs to confirm if they have a machine that falls into this category to get them while they can to help reduce the number of unnecessary calls.
_________________
"If you mess with a thing long enough, It'll break"

[tjohnson]

I've been using the new style for awhile now I'm not sure they are any better since the productions markings on them are the same as the ones I am replacing. Kip told me the problem sensors were purchased from Sharp Corp, and the new ones are from a different vendor.
Some techs are using old sensors out of trade in 3000s, the known working sensors.

[Augiedoggy]

tjohnson wrote:

I've been using the new style for awhile now I'm not sure they are any better since the productions markings on them are the same as the ones I am replacing. Kip told me the problem sensors were purchased from Sharp Corp, and the new ones are from a different vendor. Some techs are using old sensors out of trade in 3000s, the known working sensors.

I too have been replacing these Newer "improved" sensors (which are still sharp #73 units BTW) multiple times in the same machines... Like I have mentioned before I replaced the transfer sensor 3 times in one machine because of the j106 errors and I have found that a new sensor corrects that problem for months but it eventually returns... The other strange thing is I have on a number of occasions replaced one bad sensor in a machine only to have another fail in the same machine days later... this has lead me to replace the few most commonly placed sensor with failure rates in groups.
On numerous occasions one of those same sensors will fail again a few months later. I didnt know these sensors were used in so many different areas until I started having them fail..

I honestly wouldnt have made such a big stink about all of this if just replacing the sensors with newer lot # sensors corrected the problem permanently... on some of the machines this may be the case but not all.

Knock on wood I have had no sensor failures in almost two weeks...

My last failure was on a 7770 thats just about a year old and had the media length encoder sensor in drawer 2 fail right before the #2 fuser heating element.
This same sensor had already been replaced as a preventative measure along with 6 other sensors when the fuser exit sensor failed last spring. This coincided with failing hard drive error problem when the machine was just out of warranty.

[tjohnson]

I noticed that KIP released a tech bulletin regarding these sensors in 7170's, they say replace all 8 of that type of sensor and you can obtain them at zero cost, well those sensors are really cheap, it is the travel and time it takes to replace 8 sensors in each machine that costs so much. My worst machine, 3 separate failures is a 2 hour drive each way.

[Augiedoggy]

tjohnson wrote:

I noticed that KIP released a tech bulletin regarding these sensors in 7170's, they say replace all 8 of that type of sensor and you can obtain them at zero cost, well those sensors are really cheap, it is the travel and time it takes to replace 8 sensors in each machine that costs so much. My worst machine, 3 separate failures is a 2 hour drive each way.

I have you beat.... I have about 7 trips to a 7100 which is about 3hrs away... The worst part is after the second sensor failure I replaced all the sensors in the drawer including the rewind and feed encoder sensors and the transport, rear fuser exit as well as the upper exit sensors all at once only to later have one of the sensors in the drawer and both the rear fuser exit and transport sensors fail again over the course of the last year... This customer has two other locations in NY state which also have had sensor failures although to a much lesser degree..

Now I worry about the sensors I didnt realize where there like the one on the developer cam position sensor which recently failed on one of their other machines and caused a "CPLD config error" after the motor kept spinning away and finally timed out.

[jujitsu47]

does anyone have part # for the encoder above the paper roll #1 ???? cant find in manual.....

[Augiedoggy]

Sorry I dont, How did it damaged? its normally enclosed under a cover and they dont wear out? EDIT nevermind I see your talking about the media length encoder with the rubber band tire on it. I have just been cleaning the rubber with rubber rejuvenator I have left from the old tameran/printfold folders I used to work on.

.. but if you can believe it I got a service call for the machine 3 hrs away I just mentioned above about 45 minutes after posting that... its spitting out half the drawing and jamming (looks like more j106/transport sensor failure again)
If my memory is correct this will be the 4th time this same sensor will be replaced on this machine..

[Augiedoggy]

For the record my problem Yesterday was consistent j203 errors again and another media length encoder sensor took care of the issue (for the third time).

This machine only has a copy count of 4500 and since last march 5th ironically has had 5 actual sensor failures not including the time I replaced 3 of them at once with the "improved sensors" on the third sensor issue call and then 6 of them yet again on the fifth sensor failure call as preventive measures... Including the sensor that failed yesterday this machine has gone through 11 sensors and 10 or them were ordered after I was notified that the "bad ones" have been purged from inventory....

So No I don't believe the new sensors are the fix for all my machines. I suspect there may even be something else wrong this at least this 7100 machine and one of my 7770s which also has had 4 failures in less than a year. I also have a 5 month old 7170 thats had the same mid transport sensor fail twice in 2 months time and many others with only one of two failures.

[tjohnson]

It sounds like you have more sensor issues than anyone else, makes me wonder if it isn't somewhat power related specific to your area. I also have no faith the new sensors are any different than the old ones, so I don't replace them unless I have to. I will start using old sensors from trade ins on my next failure. I did install a power filter on my problem machine 2 weeks ago, so far so good.

[mark in vegas]

I've been lucky so far, no failed sensors. I have to assume that everyone carries a DVM, it's time to go old school. Break out the schematic and monitor the signal state at the PCB connection. Checking the signal at the sensor doesn't include the wiring back to the PCB. Generally speaking a high is 5vdc and the low should be well 1.5vdc, at least below 1.3vdc. Wonky sensors can check good in service mode when they're really not quite right....kinda like me
_________________
Regards,
Mark
RVN 68-69
It's so nice to be insane
No one asks you to explain

[tjohnson]

We are all a mess on here, we are being punished for poor career choices. I have not checked the signal at the board yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if the actual switching voltage is much narrower than that and that may explain how it works at times and not at others.
Whoever goes on the next sensor service call, please measure this voltage and post it, it may prove interesting.

[Augiedoggy]

tjohnson wrote:

We are all a mess on here, we are being punished for poor career choices. I have not checked the signal at the board yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if the actual switching voltage is much narrower than that and that may explain how it works at times and not at others. Whoever goes on the next sensor service call, please measure this voltage and post it, it may prove interesting.

I actually measured the voltage on a mid transport sensor and it was only like 1.437v and did not appear to change state so Im thinking it doesnt behave as normal when the clamshell is open.... I do remember only getting 1.3XX volts until replacing the sensor even though I triple checked with a meter. oddly after replacing the sensor hand getting the higher voltage I reinstalled the old one and it too also read 1.437 after the replacement/reboot..
It did not behave like the 5v setups I see in the xerox optical sensors.. I did post my results here somewhere either earlier in this thread or another related thread.

I agree that I have had more sensor issues than most and realize this looks as if I'm the issue but they are pretty cut and dry failures that go away once the sensor is replaced.
I have dragged other techs along to witness some of these... I even had another tech who covered my area for a week recently experience a failure ... oddly he has not had any himself in the NJ territory he covers.

I too have noticed that while some sensor completely fail others have just become less reliable but usually still work in service mode. oddly enough just rebooting or leaving the machine off for a while will sometimes get them working for a short time..