KeepItPrinting.com

[hvidovre]

Our company has one 8000, and customers with seven 2000, and four 6000. I am a little upset with KIP and this forum. I have been a kip tech for 7 months. I have never been a printer tech before. Anyway we have had 1 6000 with around 200,000 SF dev unit go bad. Then it happened to a 2000 with a little over 200,000 SF on it. So I'm just waiting for the others to go bad when they reach this amount of SF. Our 8000 has 2,500,000 SF and has been great, mostly minor issues. I have been trying to get to all of our 2000, and 6000 on time to scrub the toner supply roller. But for a new tech this is about a 4 hour experience. I like to take out the supply roller. I think it does a better job and does not contaminate the existing toner.

Why can't we (you) as a community come up with one procedure that works for all. You all have a lot of experience, I don't, and it is "killing me" trying to figure out the best way to support this mess that I have got myself into.

I propose that those with experience put a Tech Bulletin together for the 2000, 6000 and 8000 and any others. This is a MUST. I know that for the 8000 it is a trade secret. Sorry, that might be an issue, but we need to work it out. (How much do you want.) Out here in the west desert we don’t have the option/funds/money/time bla… bla… bla… to send our 8000 dev unit to another tech company.

I want to make things cheaper, less down time, and reliable for my customers. (Some will argue to dump the 2000 and 6000, well it’s not an option. Out west here we are lucky to know about KIP and even have one 8000 in the state of Utah.)

I can't imagine having more 2000's, I seam to live at these customers, some want to put me on the payroll. In a perfect world I would GIVE them all 8000 and use the 2000 as art in the Great Salt Lake.

Thank for letting me vent,
Ralph

[CopyTek]

I understand what you are stating and feel you make a great point. The issue is this concern should be posted on the kipamerica forum. This forum should not make you upset. This forum is the forum that accturally gives us real answers and techniques it servicing these machines. It was KIPDOCTORS instructions on servicing these dev units with screen material that has saved alot of money in service costs for my company and my customers. You won't find those answers on the kipamerica forum, they will just tell you to buy the rebuild kit. $$$$ Please if posible post this same topic on the kipamerica forum site too. You stated your concern very well. It is time to have kipamerica address it too.

Just my two cents, Respectively
_________________
This day will be my best day ever!

[Kipintern]

Hey Utah !!!

It is what it is !!! This is an unofficial site and sure the answers are here because the experience is here! Kip also has there procedure there isnt a right one and a wrong one. We all use different fixes and sullutions to the same problem. What I think is the lack of KIP experience is what is the issue!
Here is the real deal !!! You want the correct fix for pm to pm service and customer satifaction. Fly myself in and I will personally so you the right way to fix these units tricks of the trade and pm to pm service, The cost to your company is the flight and hotel I will eat the cost becuase thats the type of guy i am !!! I love to service and I love to fix Kip equipment!

just pm and me and i will give you contact info if you r serious about fixing your equipment !

[GUEST]

This forum is all that stands between KIP Dealers, and the complete collapse of tech support in this country.

The techs who post here, at least the ones known to me, are the best of the best. Some of us must post anonomously because the KIP Police are ready to retaliate at the slightest provocation.

KIP Doctor and KIP Intern have invested considerable time and resources in developing techniques for overcoming known flaws in the design of HDP Units.

If you are waiting for KIP to acknowledge a product flaw or misrepresentation as to the product's economic viability, don't hold your breath. Salt Lake City will have a Casino and Brothel before that happens.

KIP Intern's offer is a most generous one, you may want to consider it.
The techs on this forum give their time and expertise for free, something we should not take for granted.


P.S. If you are going to have the Intern visit, at least fly him first class.

[guest]

Almost forgot, here is a possible solution.

Buy a few extra supply rollers and replace them, clean them at the shop.

Buy one extra dev unit for each machine type, rework them at the shop.

Unfortunately, many new KIP dealers do not realize, or are not informed as to the amount of $$$ it takes to play at this level.

A larger KIP Dealer may have an extra unit to sell you, so you have one to rotate. Try Drexel in Missouri, Clifford Wald in Chicago, DES in California, ADS in Colorado, Patriot Blueprinting in New Jersey, or the KIP Doctor himself.

These problems either take time or money to solve, pick one and get on with business.

[Kipintern]

Hey Man dont forget the Intern I have everything in stock !!! too!

[Charlie Brown]

I feel your pain man I first I was the only tech on the kips but now there is three of us. You find this place will give you more help then any other place. I try to come here every day just to read and see if I have help for anyone. But I feel like I get more from here than I give. I been in the copier business for more than I want to say. but the guy's are right get you a spare roller to swap out. when you do rebuild the units allway put a seal kit in check the cleaning blade you can turn them over. INK is one thing to carry. D-ink is anouther thing I have a large tackel box I carry this with corona wires. I carry all my cleaning supplys I use. at first it took me about three hours to clean up a machine and rebuilt a dev unit now I at 1 1/2 to 2 hours as time gose by maybe short may not. You can only do so much in a day. don't give up. it will get better.




Grandkids make your day

[Charlie Brown]

It not INK it is INX.

[scott]

I seem to have a few extra pennies, so here is my 2 cents, plus a dollar or so.

Starting a post with "I am unhappy with this board" is what they call "flame bait"
I know you are just venting, I do feel your pain, but no one here HAS to do anything. The fact is, we aren't here to write TB's, but I bet if you read every post about the HDP developer units, applied the information, saw what worked and what didn't, you could write one.

When you mention the "trade secret" for 8000 rollers, I think know what thread you are talking about. Not only did I not have a problem with that, I now have an exchange dev unit to send off and have the magic "ancient chinese secret" performed. I support those who support me. You are coming a bit to close to criticizing the Doc.


You are lucky the Intern has mellowed with age, I believe the price used to be both first class airfare AND all the booze and jiggly bars he could consume. I would jump on this offer before the meds wear off and he recants. The Kip Intern knows what he's talking about.


Here is MY take on the developer issue. Any resemblance to reality is purely a coincidence.

The problem with the HDP dev units is a combination of the development roller getting glazed with toner and the supply roller getting filled with paper dust.

First the development roller. Heat and pressure is what makes the toner adhere.
1. Keep the ozone filters clean (I like to do this by safely wraping them in plastic and storing them on the parts shelf in the shop) this keeps the air moving.
2. Be sure the fans are clean and spinning freely (the squirrell cage fans at the exit of the 2000 are problematic)
3. This is straight from a Kip RSM (name and address witheld). Lower the pressure on the regulation roller. I usually put the spring adjusters between 1/2 and 3/4, rather than all the way. The lower the pressure, the less toner glazing on the dev roller. I have had mixed results with this, use at your own risk.
4. When dirty, clean THOROUGHLY with INX rubber roller cleaner (not INX plastic cleaner) and finish with 99% isopropyl. I have tried other cleaners and have had the best luck with INX.

The supply roller gets packed with paper dust because the Kip HDP units are toner recyclers with no way of seperating the toner from the inevitable paper dust contamination. Back in the day (back farther than I will admit) the first toner recyclers came out for the small format copiers. ALWAYS contaminated the developer with paper dust, ALWAYS. To my knowledge, all modern copiers and printers (mono or dual component) recycle toner, and every one I have serviced now has a mechanism for seperating the paper dust from the toner.

When the supply roller gets clogged with paper dust, my method is dump and toss the toner that is in the unit. This toner is contaminated with paper dust. I know this get expensive, but if you don't start with clean toner, all you are doing is bathing the freshly cleaned supply roller with paper dust. Don't believe me? Unplug the toner sensor on the 8000, then run black prints untill they get REALLY light, pull the toner hopper, scoop out a little toner and compare it to some from a toner cartridge, I doubt you will even get that far before you realise how much lighter it is. it's gray because it's got a bunch of paper dust in it. I know this will happen because.. Ahem.. I may have forgot to plug the toner sensor in on the 8000 in production once.
Ok, sorry about the paper dust tirade, it is an issue with the HDP dev units I can live with when the alternative is a cleaning blade system.

So, either way, be certian your dev bias voltages are correct and adjusted to current spec.
When you have to clean the roller, a stiff nylon brush followed by a chunk of screen material followed by the brush and then a vacuum should do it.
I know it may be over kill, just get it good and clean.

I only get pm to pm from my 4 high volume 2000's (12,000 to 15,000 plus square/month) The low volume machines will need the dev unit cleaned at a shorter square footage interval. I'm looking into that first class ticket and stocking up on the booze, then I'm gonna call the Kip intern myself!
One of my 2000's seems to defy logic and give me nothing but trouble, regardless what I do, so I completely understand your frustration.
Ask nicely and you will recieve all the help you need.


Scott

[Kipintern]

Hey Scott,
Thanks for the plug, theses days I could use it.
Hey man I havent mellowed with age, just trying to keep my HEAD ABOVE WATER , You Guys know what I mean !

I am glad you are on the right track , and dude I will come out still, No first flight ticket needed man.

Just point me in the direction of the giggly joint and have a couple beers with me. I am sure I could drum up some business out there to put on my back, and help you out any way possible.

Hey posters, I am gonna be active again so, get ready dudes and dudettes !

Later Scott